|
Tom & Jerry Spotlight Collection - best set?
is the "Tom & Jerry Spotlight Collection" the best collection to get?
best video + audio? are these uncut? i've read that some versions of these had mistakes/errors. but also that WB re-issued corrections. plus, Mouse Cleaning and Casanova Cat are missing in the USA versions. but are available in the european classics collection. does the USA version of Touché, Pussy Cat! have the stereo mix Tuffy singing "Frère Jacques"? apparently only the mono mix has it. is "His Mouse Friday" the cut version? so, are these the only issues, or are there more? is there a site with a comprehensive breakdown of errors? finally, has anyone got the complete T&J spotlight sets? |
I don't have this but they are probably the best retail sets out there. According to wikipedia.org , both the us and the uk versions have problems. I guess some episodes were cut or altered too.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_and_jerry I have an old Chinese 6 dvd import set but still haven't verified how many episodes are in it. This set probably isn't the best quality since it is on less discs but I think the episodes might be uncut and uncensored. I might make a set in the future with these episodes since the menu is in Chinese and is so confusing. |
ta for your reply D17.
that was a helpful link. LS - your T&J set - is it the same as what's on offer in the T&J Spotlight Collection? |
I have the 6-disc Chinese set. Quality is good (unrestored, but still good), and 99% uncut. Original audio, including Mammy with her 1940s southern Black dialect -- not the new Oprah sound-alike (yuck!). It has all 92 MGM shorts. It was released almost 10 years ago. There are still a few missing scenes, but those have been missing since at least the 1970s. I have a full breakdown of edits somewhere. I know Aaron Handy III, huge T&J fan, wrote a page about it some years ago. Not sure if it's still online. (He still has stuff online, but don't think this exact piece is anywhere anymore.)
WB screwed up the Spotlight discs. Some were fixed, some not. The only real benefit of those sets is that the original widescreen is there for some episodes. Just a few, actually -- bonuses. I have at least 1-2 of the sets for this reason, received as gifts. The 10-disc Japanese set is edited, censored, Oprah voice, but includes the post-MGM shorts by Chuck Jones. This is at least 8 years old. There's a separate set for the Deitch episodes, that was sold in Europe. My set came from Poland about 6 years ago. These are uncut, and look restored from what I recall. |
here's a link to all the T&J episodes.
|
so LS, when you get a chance, could you please post a list of what you have, if anything has been cut/edited, whether you need episodes to complete your set etc.
i would like to put together the best possible T&J set available. cheers |
It looks like the Chinese set lordsmurf and I have is missing 22 episodes. Wikipedia says that there were 114 MGM episodes.
I have these if you need them but they are Homebrew and from recent tv airings. Tom and Jerry: Chuck Jones Series (1963-1967) (3 DVD’s) 8.5/10 Tom and Jerry: Gene Deitch Series (1961-1962) (1 DVD) 8.5-9/10 I would be great to see just one set of the MGM cartoons and have the Chuck Jones and Gene Deitch sets seperate since the cartoons are so different. |
is this the menu for the 6 disc chinese t&j set?
http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...tj-chinese.jpg if so, i think i'll try and clean it up a little. LS, which sets of the T&J Spotlights have you got? i can try and get the others and perhaps we can colaborate together for a "best possible" T&J set? |
DJ17 - your homebrew sets - are these the only ones available? ie no retail releases?
|
i know this is a technical question and belongs in another thread, but i ask for your indulgence this one time!
the T&J set i have. it has "combing" effects. as i'm trying to clean up the image, i thought i'd get rid of this as well. so the question to you is what is the best method to do this? i have tmpgenc xpress. these are the options: Deinterlace mode Sets the deinterlace filter operation mode. No deinterlace ============================ Do not perform any deinterlacing operations. When an interlaced clip is used, disabling the deinterlace while making an output in progressive mode may give unexpected results. Deinterlace only when necessary ============================ Automatically deinterlaces according to the output settings. When performing a deinterlace, this uses the method set by the Deinterlace method: setting. Deinterlace always ============================ Deinterlaces whatever the output settings. When the output is set to interlaced, the clip is deinterlaced once then interlaced. Deinterlace always (Double framerate) ============================ Deconstructs 29.97 or 25 fps clip fields and processes them to 59.94 or 50 fps. 24 fps (Special animation) ============================ Reduces the clip’s framerate from 29.97 or 50 fps to 23.976 or 25 fps by using a method that prioritizes the removing the interlace stripes. 24 fps (Prioritize motion) ============================ Reduces the clip’s framerate from 29.97 or 50 fps to 23.976 or 25 fps by using a method prioritizing the clip’s motion Deinterlace field Set the base field used to deinterlace and interpolate the progressive picture. Choose the most suitable base field by visually comparing the two option results. Deinterlace by top field ============================ Deinterlaces by using the top field as the base. Deinterlace by bottom field ============================ Deinterlaces by using the bottom field as the base. Deinterlace method Sets the deinterlace method. Interpolation - simple ============================ Displays the average value of the top and bottom field. Replication - simple ============================ Displays a shade off of the top and bottom fields. This makes the image blurry and leaves an afterimage in moving parts. Interpolation - adjusted ============================ Interpolates the interlace stripes by referring to the previous and following images of the clip. Interpolation - animation ============================ Interpolates the interlace stripes by referring to the previous and following images of the clip and searches for the parts where interlacing appears. Interpolation - animation 2 ============================ Interpolates the interlace stripes by referring to the previous and following images of the clip and searches more thoroughly for the parts where interlacing appears. Because of the analysis method, opposite interlace stripes may be missed. Replication - animation ============================ Researches the interlace stripes and duplicates them by referring to the previous and following images. Inverse pulldown ============================ Refers to the previous and following images and chooses the one without interlace stripes. Simple 2 line duplication on stripes only ============================ Detects high difference levels between two fields and then duplicates them locally, one line from the first field to the other. This method may reduce the picture’s fine details. Inverse pulldwon + Simple 2 line duplication ============================ Performs inverse pulldown processing to recover the original picture, then duplicates it locally, one line from the first field to the other if high difference levels are detected between two pictures. Weave ============================ Uses the same method than TV where an image is synthesized with an odd and even field. This method is not very used compared to Double framerate. so which of those do i use? cheers |
here is my initial effort.
original screencap: http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...30-tj-orig.jpg modified: http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...j-cleaned1.jpg i've removed quite a bit of "noise". i've also boosted the "colour" - but have i overdone it? should i change any other setting - like brightness, contrast etc? also removed the annoying "white noise bar" at the top. used a black mask at the top only. is this the right thing to do? |
|
I have a 10 Chinese disc set that came with more than 100 other Disney/cartoon DVDs. I think the DVDs came from this boxset
All Fullscreen with English and Mandarin Languages with English and Chinese Subtitles (removable). - #1 : "Flirty Birdy" (1945) (Uncensored), "The Cat Above and The Mouse Below" (1964), "Jerry's Diary" (Uncensored) (1949), "The Cat's Me-Ouch" (1965), "That's My Pup" (1953), "Duel Personality" (1966), "Guided Mouse-ille" (1966), "Just Ducky" (1953), "Hunted Mouse" (1965), "Neapolitan Mouse" (1954), "Jerry-Go-Round" (1966), "Kitty Foiled" (1948), "Much Ado About Mousing" (1964), "Pent-House Mouse" (1963) - #2: "Texas Tom" (1950), "Puss 'n' Boats" (1966), "That's My Mommy" (1955), "Down Beat Bear" (1956), "Surf-Bored Cat" (1967), "Triplet Trouble" (1952), "Mucho Mouse" (1957), "The Flying Cat" (1952), "The Bodyguard" (1944), "The Little Orphan" (1949) (Censored), "Jerry's Cousin" (1951), "Dr, Jekyll and Mr Mouse" (1947), "Mice Follies" (1954), "The Cat and Mermouse" (1949), "The Cat Concerto" (1947) - #3: "Mouse Trouble" (1944) (Uncensored), "Jerry and the Loin" (1950), "Mouse in Manhattan" (Uncensored) (1945), "The Milky Waif" (Censored) (1946), "Cat Napping" (1951), "Saturday Evening Puss" (1950) (Uncensored), "Hic-Cup Pup" (1954), "The Invisible Mouse" (1947), "The Million Dollar Cat" (1944), "The Night Before Christmas" (1941), "Polka-Dot Puss" (1949), "Two Little Indians" (1953), "Trap Happy" (Uncensored?) (1946), "Tom and Jerry in the Hollywood Bowl" (1950), "Cue Ball Cat" (1950), "Little Runaway" (1952) (Uncensored) - 4#: Contains: "Fraidy Cat" (1942) (Uncensored), "Baby Butch" (1954), "Johann Mouse" (1953), "Pet Peeve" (Censored) (1954), "The Mouse from H.U.N.G.E.R." (1967), "The Dog House" (1952), "Baby Puss" (1943), "The Zoot Cat" (1944), "Puss Gets The Boot" (1940) (Censored) (Tom & Jerry's first cartoon), "The Midnight Snack" (1941), "Dog Trouble" (1942) (Censored, Mammy's voice is redubbed), "Puss 'n' Toots" (1942) (Uncensored), "The Bowling Alley-Cat" (1942), "Is There a Doctor in the Mouse?" (1964), "The Yankee Doodle Mouse" (1943) (Uncensored), - 5#: "Fine Feathered Friend" (1942), "Sufferin Cats!" (1943), "Snowbody Loves Me" (1964), "The Lonesome Mouse" (1943), "The Unshrinkalbe Jerry Mouse" (1964), "Puttin' on the Dog" (1944), "The Mouse Comes to Dinner" (1945) (Uncensored), "Tee for Two" (1945), "Springtime for Thomas" (1946), "Ah, Sweet Mouse-Story of Live" (1965), "Solid Serenade" (1946) , "Tom-ic Energy" (1965), "Cat Fishin'" (1947), "Quite Please!" (1945), - 6#: "Party Time Pal" (1947) (Censored), "Salt Water Tabby" (1947), "Bad Day at Cat Rock" (1965), "A Mouse in the House" (1947) (Censored), "The Brothers Carry-Mouse-Off" (1965), "Old Rockin' Chair Tom" (1948), "The Truce Hurts" (1948) (Censored), "Professor Tom" (1948), "Mouse Cleaning" (1948) (Censored), "I'm Just Wild About Jerry" (1965), "Hatch Up Your Troubles" (1949) , "Of Feline Bondage" (1965), "Love That Pup" (1949), "Heavenly Puss" (1949), - #7: "Tennis Chumps" (1949), "Little Quacker" (1950), "The Year of the Mouse" (1965), "Safety Second" (1950) (Uncensored), "Jerry Jerry Quite Contrary" (1966), "The Framed Cat" (1950) (Censored, Mammy's voice is redubbed), "Casanova Cat" (1951) (Uncensored), "Jerry and the Goldfish" (1951), "Sleeply-Time Tom" (1951), "Love Me, Love My Mouse" (1966), "His Mouse Friday" (1951) (Uncensored, Zoomed verison to remove a small cannibal at the end), "The A-Tom-inable Snowman" (1966), "Nit-Witty Kitty" (1951) (At the end of the cartoon Mammy creeps up on Tom with a baseball bat and reads from the book "It says here, a sharp blow on the head is a sure cure for amnesia, and that's what you're gonna get" These lines are supposedly removed on the original R1 spotlight collection 2), "The Duck Doctor" (1952), - #8: "Fit to be Tied" (1952), "Push-Button Kitty" (1952), "Filet Meow" (1966), "Cruise Cat" (1952), "Catty-Cornered" (1966), "The Two Mouseketeers" (1952) (Uncensored), "Little School Mouse" (1954), "Jerry and Jumbo" (1953), "Smitten Kitten" (1952), "Cat and Dupli-Cat" (1966), "Life with Tom" (1953) (Censored), "O-Solar-Meow" (1966), "Posse Cat" (1954), "The Missing Mouse" (1953), - #9: "Downhearted Duckling" (1954), "Touché Pussy Cat!" (1954), "Rock 'n' Rodent" (1967), "Southbound Duckling" (1955), "Cannery Rodnet" (1967), "Pup on a Picnic" (1955), "Mouse For Sale" (1955), "Designs on Jerry" (1955), "Tom and Chérie" (1955), "Advance and be Mechanized" (1967), "Smarty Cat" (1955), "Pecos Pest" (1955), - #10: "Muscle Beach Tom" (1956), "Blue Cat Blues" (1956), "Barbecue Brawl" (1956), "Purr-Chance to Dream" (1967), "Timid Tabby" (1957), "Happy Go Ducky" (1958), "Royal Cat Nap" (1958), "The Vanishing Duck" (1958), "Mantinee Mouse" (1966), "Robin Hoodwinked" (1958), "Tot Watchers" (1958), "The Flying Sorceress" (1955), |
Manthing, you overdid the color. That cyan increase will make a TV go wonky.
Your luminance exceeds NTSC/PAL color safe palettes. You also introduced chroma errors in your efforts -- notice the yellow now on her arm. You do NOT want to deinterlace. DO NOT DE-INTERLACE. Even if there was a reason to deinterlace, you'd want to do it with special motion compensating methods via Avisynth scripting. Animation is too needy even for the generally-good base Yadif method. TMPGEnc deinterlacers are very destructive to both motion and linear animation accuracy. There's something missing about the 92 vs 114 shorts information. There was something special about the first 92 that often consider them the "classic" set, vs the next 22 shorts that finished out the MGM run. It's been a decade since I looked into it, so I forgot what it was. I thought it was Chuck Jones involvement, but apparently that came later. No, that's not the menu for the 6-disc Chinese set. That's some homemade set you have. The original Chinese set is written in Mandarin. The Japanese set is in Japanese. The Polish Deitch set, however, is in English, as it appears to be a precursor version to the UK release. I've overstretched myself, so I don't know how quickly I can help with anything right now. My current CPS focus is the X-MEN bonus for cnickle. |
LS - sure, take your time. no rush at all.
what tools did you use to deduce that the color, luminance and chroma were way off? let me know / point me towards guides, so that i learn and don't repeat the mistakes. also, why should i NOT deinterlace? is there a guide that explains things clearly? finally, as far as i can remember, the 6 disc T&J set came from you! but i'll leave things until you get back to me about exactly what T&J stuff you have. cheers. |
I used my eyes, and I have a calibrated IPS LCD monitor.
I just know. After a few year, you learn what is and isn't too much luma/chroma adjusting. Interlacing is addressed here: Understanding Your Source (Interlace vs. Progressive vs. De-Interlace) "Finally, as far as i can remember, the 6 disc T&J set came from you!" -- Nope. I have that one, too, but I've never given it out. |
ok, this has video noise removal and black bar at top only.
let me know if this is acceptable or not. |
I really hate Megaupload/etc. I don't have time to wait on that.
Attach to forum posts. Or let's you and me share a Dropbox. |
1 Attachment(s)
They released the chuck jones collection on dvd but no Gene Deitch yet.
http://www.amazon.com/Tom-Jerry-Chuc...3150835&sr=8-1 Here is the episode menu of the 6 DVD Hong Kong set:Attachment 1201 |
DJ17 - your HK T&J set - do you know if they are all uncut / unaltered? or if not, any ideas what has changed? thanks.
|
i'll add what i can find about cuts here...
"Puss Gets the Boot" (10 Feb 1940) Mammy's voice was redubbed fairly early on (before they started using the white maid voice), in the original, Mammy says "O-W-T...Out!" & later in the cartoon “O-U-W-T‚Out!". In the edited version, she spells it correctly ("O-U-T"). http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...648-owtuz5.jpg "Fraidy Cat" (17 Jan 1942) After Jerry climbs the washboard, Mammy looks for a burgler and is attacked by Tom, all these shots get removed. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...fraidy2dc1.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...-fraidyii1.jpg "Dog Trouble" (18 Apr 1942) Mammy's voice is redubbed, or sometimes Mammy's appearance at the end was removed. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...651-dogas7.jpg "Puss N' Toots" (30 May 1942) The scene on the record player has a section removed from the middle. The part where Jerry gets a tail full of record needles and a record lands on Tom's head making him look Chinese, followed by Jerry mocking Tom is hacked out. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...sntootsaa7.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...ntoots2zo5.jpg This cartoon has an alternate cut where a whole chunk featuring Mammy was removed from the start along with a filing cabinet gag. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...stoots5se9.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...stoots3es9.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...stoots4sq5.jpg "Yankee Doodle Mouse" (26 June 1943) Tom as a “blackface flower" after an exploding teapot is often removed. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...57-yankee2.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...nkeedoodle.jpg "Mouse Trouble" (23 Nov 1944) Tom hides in a package addressed to Jerry. Jerry begins to stick hat pins into the box and saws it in half. Jerry finally takes a look at what is inside and holds up a sign: "Is there a doctor in the house?" this was sometimes edited out. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...usetrouble.jpg "The Mouse Comes to Dinner" (2 May 1945) The original opening showing Mammy singing and setting the dinner table and Jerry sneaking across the table pretending to be a Red Indian is removed. The cut cartoon begins as Tom pops out of the potted plant. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...dinner1ml5.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...dinner2hk8.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...dinner3oe2.jpg |
"Mouse in Manhattan" (7 July 1945)
The scene in which Jerry's head gets stuck in a bottle of shoe polish is shortened to remove the blackface gag. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...hatten1uq3.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...hatten3ya3.jpg "Flirty Birdy" (22 Sept 1945) The bird tosses Tom out of a tree into a garden path then Tom gets pulled back up the tree and thrown down the hollow trunk into the laundry on the washing line where Tom does an Indian chief impression (there is no laundry basket). The edited version ends the scene after he hits the path. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...flirty2bh0.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...flirty3ur2.jpg http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...flirty4vt6.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...flirty1wt2.jpg An alternate cut to this cartoon is to leave all the visuals intact and remove some words, originally the bird says "Going Down" just before he throws Tom down the inside of the tree trunk, and "She loves me" when they play around the brick chimney but these get muted. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...flirty5hp1.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...flirty6hg6.jpg "The Milky Waif" (18 May 1946) Missing is a scene where Jerry and Nibbles try to fool Tom by disguising themselves as "slave stereotypes" with some shoe polish. In the cut version you see Nibbles, held up by Jerry, spitting milk into Tom's face, then you see them run away from Tom into another room where Tom gets a frying pan in the face. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...1-waif1kf6.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...2-waif2kw6.jpg "Trap Happy" (29 June 1946) Jerry is being divided in two by the "Exterminator cat" Jerry slips Toms tail in his place. Tom's tail being chopped with an axe was shortened to remove the axe fall. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...3-trap1cu8.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...4-trap2cd0.jpg |
"Part-Time Pal" (15 Mar 1947)
Mammy's voice is redubbed & some of the words were changed. Originally, she says "Well slap my face if this ain't a mess!", but in the new version, she says "Well I'll be darned this is such a mess!" Also Tom's "One for the money, two for the show..." where he is about to throw water over the sleeping mammy is muted leaving only the drunken "HICS", but his lips still move. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...rttime2su2.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...rttime2kn5.jpg "A Mouse in the House" (30 Aug 1947) Originally the two cats look in the gas oven and Jerry throws a match in to cause an explosion, both cats ended up blackface. This was shortened and the scene ends with the explosion to remove the blackface joke. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...nhouse1jz7.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...nhouse2cz0.jpg "Kitty Foiled" (1 Jun 1948) Shortly after the "floorboard on the tail" Jerry and the canary hide themselves behind a curtain that looks like a wigwam. The pair emerge disguised as a Red Indian and papoose, this scene is removed. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...-kitty1ua4.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...-kitty2rk7.jpg "The Truce Hurts" (17 July 1948) A passing meat truck splashes mud on Tom, Jerry, and Spike leaving them all in blackface and is shortened in the recut to end at the splash. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...-truce1xy8.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...-truce2fx6.jpg "Old Rockin' Chair Tom" (18 Sept 1948) Mammy's voice is redubbed and changed. Originally, she said "Take care of old old Uncle Tom," this was changed to "Take care of old Tom. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...84-old1ot7.jpg "Mouse Cleaning" (11 Dec 1948) After the coal spill at the end of the cartoon, Tom originally comes out of the pile of coal in blackface. Mammy asks black Tom, if he has seen a cat. Tom replies "No ma'am, I ain't seen no cat, nowhere, nohow!". On the new version this was shortened and she just yells and starts throwing coal. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...eaning1ad3.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...eaning2ff2.jpg "The Little Orphan" (30 April 1949) A candle fired by Nibbles lands on Tom's tail was cut (50s) or reanimated (60s). Originally after the candle set Tom on fire, he appeared in blackface. In the 50s version the candle lands on Tom's tail but nothing happens. Also gone was the part directly following the candle scene, in which some airborne Champagne bottles hit the blackened Tom in the back of the head causing him to fly into the cabinet of dishes. The 60s version was redrawn to have Tom retain his Indian headdress which was absent in the original version. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...orphan1tm5.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...orphan2lt5.jpg 60s version redrawn by the Chuck Jones team http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...lilorphan2.jpg |
"Jerry's Diary" (22 Oct 1949)
The exploding teapot scene taken from "Yankee Doodle Mouse" fades out early to remove a “blackface flower" gag. "Saturday Evening Puss" (14 Jan 1950) The new version has redrawn footage of a young white teenager who goes to a party which replaces the original footage of a rather sexy looking Mammy who went out to play cards. Jerry's rant to Tom about the noisy music that Tom and his friends are making is muted for some reason. In the original, Jerry starts yelling "I'm trying to sleep and youse guys are out here goin' BANG BANG BANG BANG!!!" in a Bronx accent. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...0825193738.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...ymammy2th3.jpg 60s version redrawn by Chuck Jones team http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...ayteen1gr2.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...ayteen2lq5.jpg "Safety Second" (1 July 1950) Near the end of the cartoon Jerry blew on a noisemaker containing a hidden firecracker and was left as a blackface flower. This scene was shortened to end at the explosion. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...safety1hb3.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...safety2hr3.jpg "The Framed Cat" (21 Oct 1950) Mammy has been replaced with a white maid on some versions (or just her voice) "Casanova Cat" (6 Jan 1951) Tom breaths cigar smoke in Jerry's face causing Jerry to have a blackface then heats a tray under his feet to make him dance. The new version cuts from Jerry as a wind up mouse to the mouse throwing a note to Butch in a paper airplane. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...sanova1ae6.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...sanova2hm9.jpg |
"His Mouse Friday" (7 July 1951)
The cut version has all the cannibal dialogue edited out. All the natives and Jerry's native talk were muted, even though you see all the characters' lips moving. In the original Jerry talks nonsense words and the cannibals say "Hmmmmm barbecued cat ........... Hmmmmm barbecued mouse" http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...friday2ym6.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...98-friday1.jpg Some versions are zoomed in to remove this small cannibal. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...ridayukle0.jpg "Nit-witty Kitty" (6 Oct 1951) At the end of the cartoon Mammy creeps up on Tom with a baseball bat and reads from the book "It says here, a sharp blow on the head is a sure cure for amnesia, and that's what you're gonna get" These lines are supposedly removed on the original R1 spotlight collection 2, but is back in the later corrected disk. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...-kitty3og9.jpg "The Two Mouseketeers" (15 Mar 1952) The original ending showed that the king beheaded Tom with a guillotine, but you only ever saw the blade fall, this was removed. "Little Runaway" (14 June 1952) The scene where the seal throws Tom against a bird bath results in a Chinese gag and has been shortened to end on the third screenshot. (there is no trash can, it is a bird bath) http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...little4lj1.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...little1dj9.jpghttp://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...little2xf8.jpg "Life With Tom" (21 Nov 1953) In a scene identical to “The Little Orphan" the candle burns Tom and the scene was shortened to end here, before a blackface gag and a hit in the back of the head with a champagne bottle. http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...re705-life.jpg |
China 140 cartoon boxset (leisurejoys 10 DVDs R0 NTSC)
This is not a BOOTLEG under China copyright law, China considers movies in the public domain after a much shorter period (25 years) than the USA and Europe (70 years). The packaging gives its' true status away, nice on the outside, cheap in the inside. It also contains the redrawn version of "Saturday Night Puss" (white teenager) and the muted version of "His Mouse Friday". "Puss 'n' Toots has Mammy removed, "The Framed Cat" has Mammy with an Irish voice. Video quality is better than VHS but worse than "real" DVDs (the source is clearly magnetic tape of some kind). Some of the cartoons are overexposed. All CinemaScope cartoons are cropped. Missing Hanna Barbera cartoons:- Just Ducky, The Egg and Jerry, Busy Buddies, Top with Pops, Feeding the Kiddy, Photo Finish, Happy go Ducky, Royal Cat Nap. Missing ALL Gene Deitch cartoons:- Switchin' Kitten, Down and Outing, It's Greek To Me-ow!, High Steaks, Mouse Into Space, Landing Stripling, Calypso Cat, Dicky Moe, The Tom and Jerry Cartoon Kit, Tall In the Trap, Sorry Safari, Sorry Safari, Carmen Get It! UK Tom And Jerry Complete Classic Collection (HMV Exclusive 6 flipper disks PAL R2, 159 cartoon boxset) Not all that exclusive as it is the 3 Digipaks previously released, sold in a big outer slipcase. Milky Waif, A Mouse in the House, The Truce Hurts, Little Orphan & Life With Tom are all censored. His mouse Friday has the reframed pygmy, Flirty Birdy has the "Going down" & "She loves me" muted. Mammy has been revoiced by an unknown actress on most (if not all) of the cartoons up to and including "Old Rocking Chair Tom" This is the most complete boxset available and is only missing "The Million Dollar Cat" & "Busy Buddies". Picture quality is very variable, there has been no attempt to restore any of the cartoons, some are very dirty and scratched, others look great. Most of the CinemaScope cartoons are cropped. The US Tom and Jerry Spotlight Collections Can be either cut or uncut depending on when you purchased the disks. If you buy the disks today (Apr 08, 2007) , Collection 2 will most likely be uncut but Collection 1 only has the cut version on sale. There are interlacing problems on some of the cartoons (I can confirm "The Milky Waif has both of these problems). The quality of the prints is very variable, some like "Puss gets the Boot" have been remastered and look very good (still plenty of marks), others like "Puss 'n' Toots" are dirty and marked. The colour is strong on all of them though. All the widescreen cartoons are shown in their original AR. |
here is a comparison of some of the available sets:
korea http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...e707-korea.jpg china: http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...e708-china.jpg usa: http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...e706-usar1.jpg uk boxset: http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...0-ukboxset.jpg uk tv: http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...e709-ukair.jpg conclusion: they all have good & bad! perhaps we have to mix & match? this final picture is from the new set i created: http://www.tvpast.org/forum/members/...17-tj-snap.jpg looks close to the USA set but cleaned up a bit? |
further info regarding cuts:
"Puss Gets the Boot" (Hanna and Barbera; 1940): Mammy's voice has been redubbed in the version on Cartoon Network. In the original, Mammy said "O-W-T...Out!" in this edited version, she spells it correctly ("O-U-T"). "Puss N' Toots" (Hanna and Barbera; 1942): The Chinese gag on the record player, where a record lands on Tom's head making him look Chinese followed by Jerry mockingly imitating his foe's predicament, is edited. Sometimes the scenes at the beginning featuring Mammy were removed. "Dog Trouble" (Hanna and Barbera; 1942): The version that occasionally plays on Cartoon Network has Mammy's voice redubbed. Mammy's appearance at the end is sometimes removed. "Fraidy Cat" (Hanna and Barbera; 1942): This cartoon is missing the scenes with Mammy Two-Shoes. "Yankee Doodle Mouse" (Hanna and Barbera; 1943): Tom in blackface as a result of an exploding teapot is removed. "Mouse Trouble" (Hanna and Barbera; 1944): Tom hides in a package addressed to Jerry. Jerry begins to stick hat pins into the box and saws it in half. Jerry finally takes a look at what is inside and holds up a sign: "Is there a doctor in the house?". This was removed on some local stations. "The Mouse Comes to Dinner" (Hanna and Barbera; 1945): The opening showing Mammy singing and setting the dinner table and Jerry sneaking across the table pretending to be an Indian is cut. The cartoon now begins as Tom pops out of the potted plant. "Mouse in Manhattan" (Hanna and Barbera; 1945): The scene in which Jerry's head gets stuck in a bottle of shoe polish is abruptly cut short. In the original, Jerry emerges from the shoe polish bottle in blackface. "Flirty Birdy" (Hanna and Barbera; 1945): The entire scene where the bird tosses Tom into the laundry and Tom emerges looking like an Indian chief is edited out. "The Milky Waif" (Hanna and Barbera; 1946): Missing is a scene where Jerry and Nibbles try to fool Tom by disguising themselves in blackface with some shoe polish. As edited, you see a scene where Nibbles, held up by Jerry, spits milk into Tom's face, and you see them run away from Tom into another room. The next thing you see, abruptly, is Tom running face first into a frying pan that the mice are holding up in a doorway. "Trap Happy" (Hanna and Barbera; 1946): A scene where a cat accidentally misses Jerry and chops off Tom's tail with an ax was cut. "A Mouse in the House" (Hanna and Barbera; 1947): The scene where the two cats look in the oven, only to have Jerry cause an explosion with a match, leaving them in blackface was deleted. "Part-Time Pal" (Hanna and Barbera; 1947): Mammy's voice is redubbed. Some of her dialogue was changed in the process. In the original, she says in one scene "Well slap my face if this ain't a mess!", but in the redubbed, she says "Well I'll be darned. This is such a mess!" Other oddities in the Cartoon Network version included the muting out of Tom's "One for the money, two for the show..." at the end, before drenching Mammy with a jug of water. "Mouse Cleaning" (Hanna and Barbera; 1948): After the huge coal spill at the end of the cartoon, Tom originally came out of the pile of coal in blackface. Mammy asks Tom, who she thinks is a man, if he has seen a cat. Tom responds "No ma'am, I ain't seen no cat!" a la Stepin Fetchit. Mammy sees through Tom's impression and yells "THOMAS!". There is a cut from the coal spill to Mammy yelling at Tom and Tom running away. This cartoon is NOT included in any of The Spotlight Collection DVDs. "Old Rockin' Chair Tom" (Hanna and Barbera; 1948): The "uncle" in "poor old uncle Tom" is absent, and in some copies Mammy has a different voice. There are multiple versions of Mammy's voice. And I think the purpose of shortening Mammy's line to "Take good care of Tom" was to remove the scene where Lightning puts shaving cream on Tom and gives him a cane, rather than the offense of the dialog. "Kitty Foiled" (Hanna and Barbera; 1948): The scene where Jerry and the canary disguise themselves as Indians to trick Tom is cut. "The Truce Hurts" (Hanna and Barbera; 1948): The passing meat truck splashes mud on Tom, Jerry, and Spike. This leaves the trio in blackface for a few seconds which are now cut. "Jerry's Diary" (Hanna and Barbera; 1949): The exploding teapot scene from "Yankee Doodle Mouse" fades out early. "The Little Orphan" (Hanna and Barbera; 1949): The scene in which a candle fired by Nibbles lands on Tom's tail was reanimated. Originally, as a result of the candle setting him on fire, Tom appeared shortly in blackface. The stereotypical results were cleaned up by having Tom retain his Indian headdress which was absent in the original version. Another edit has the candle land on Tom's tail but nothing happens. Also gone was the part directly following the candle scene, in which some airborne champaign bottles hit the blackened Tom in the back of the head causing him to fly into the cabinet of dishes. "Safety Second" (Hanna and Barbera; 1950): The cartoon ended abruptly after Jerry blew on a noisemaker in which Nibbles had hidden a 4th of July firecracker. After the explosion, Jerry was left in blackface. "Saturday Evening Puss" (Hanna and Barbera; 1950): Some versions features footage of the young white lady which was animated to replace footage of Mammy. However, Mammy's original voice was heard on the soundtrack! There is a version with the young white lady voiced by June Foray was released on the videotape THE VERY BEST OF TOM & JERRY and THE ART TOM & JERRY laserdisc set. Jerry's rant to Tom about the noisy music that Tom and his friends are making was silent. In the original, Jerry starts yelling what sounded like "I'm trying to get some sleep and youse guys are out here goin' BANG BANG BANG BANG!!!" "Casanova Cat" (Hanna and Barbera; 1951): Tom breathing cigar smoke in Jerry's face causing Jerry to do a blackface dance is deleted but the scene where Tom coming up from the sofa with rings around his neck isn't. "His Mouse Friday" (Hanna and Barbera; 1951): The version released on the TOM & JERRY ON PARADE videotape and THE ART OF TOM & JERRY laserdisc set has all the cannibal dialogue edited out. All the natives and Jerry's imitation were silent, even though the audience saw all the characters' lips moving. The Tom and Jerry: Spotlight Collection Vol. 3 has the dialogue restorted, but it cuts out the small cannibal at the end. "Little Runaway" (Hanna and Barbera; 1952): The baby seal throwing a trash can cover at Tom causing Tom to look Chinese is cut. "The Two Mouseketeers" (Hanna and Barbera; 1952): The ending where it is suggested that the king beheaded Tom offscreen was cut. "Life With Tom" (Hanna and Barbera; 1953): The scene from "The Little Orphan" fades out early after the candle burns Tom. The blackface results are not seen. |
if you know more, please add to this thread. thanks.
|
i read somewhere that these are the true, original HB T&J cartoons:
001 - Puss Gets the Boot [1939] 002 - Midnight Snack [1941] 003 - Night Before Christmas [1941] 004 - Fraidy Cat [1941] 005 - Dog Trouble [1942] 006 - Puss 'n Toots [1942] 007 - The Bowling Alley-Cat [1942] 008 - Fine Feathered Friend [1942] 009 - Sufferin' Cats! [1942] 010 - The Lonesome Mouse [1943] 011 - The Yankee Doodle Mouse [1943] 012 - Baby Puss [1943] 013 - Zoot Cat [1944] 014 - The Million Dollar Cat [1944] 015 - The Bodyguard [1944] 016 - Puttin' on the Dog [1944] 017 - Mouse Trouble [1944] 018 - The Mouse Comes to Dinner [1945] 019 - Mouse in Manhattan [1945] 020 - Tee for Two [1945] 021 - Flirty Birdy [1945] 022 - Quiet Please! [1945] 023 - Springtime for Thomas [1946] 024 - The Milky Waif [1946] 025 - Trap Happy [1946] 026 - Solid Serenade [1946] 027 - Cat Fishin' [1946] 028 - Part Time Pal [1946] 029 - The Cat Concerto [1946] 030 - Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Mouse [1946] 031 - Salt Water Tabby [1947] 032 - A Mouse in the House [1947] 033 - The Invisible Mouse [1947] 034 - Kitty Foiled [1947] 035 - The Truce Hurts [1947] 036 - Old Rockin' Chair Tom [1947] 037 - Professor Tom [1948] 038 - Mouse Cleaning [1948] 039 - Polka-Dot Puss [1948] 040 - The Little Orphan [1948] 041 - Hatch Up Your Troubles [1948] 042 - Heavenly Puss [1948] 043 - The Cat and the Mermouse [1949] 044 - Love That Pup [1949] 045 - Jerry's Diary [1949] 046 - Tennis Chumps [1949] 047 - Little Quacker [1950] 048 - Saturday Evening Puss [1950] 049 - Texas Tom [1950] 050 - Jerry and the Lion [1950] 051 - Safety Second [1950] 052 - Tom and Jerry in the Hollywood Bowl [1950] 053 - The Framed Cat [1950] 054 - Cue Ball Cat [1950] 055 - Casanova Cat [1950] 056 - Jerry and the Goldfish [1951] 057 - Jerry's Cousin [1951] 058 - Sleepy-Time Tom [1951] 059 - His Mouse Friday [1951] 060 - Slicked-up Pup [1951] 061 - Nit-Witty Kitty [1951] 062 - Cat Napping [1951] 063 - The Flying Cat [1952] 064 - The Duck Doctor [1952] 065 - The Two Mouseketeers [1952] 066 - Smitten Kitten [1952] 067 - Triplet Trouble [1952] 068 - Little Runaway [1952] 069 - Fit to Be Tied [1952] 070 - Push-Button Kitty [1952] 071 - Cruise Cat [1951] 072 - The Dog House [1952] 073 - The Missing Mouse [1951] 074 - Jerry and Jumbo [1951] 075 - Johann Mouse [1952] 076 - That's My Pup! [1952] 077 - Just Ducky [1951] 078 - Two Little Indians [1952] 079 - Life with Tom [1952] 080 - Puppy Tale [1953] 081 - Posse Cat [1952] 082 - Hic-cup Pup [1952] 083 - Little School Mouse [1952] 084 - Baby Butch [1953] 085 - Mice Follies [1953] 086 - Neapolitan Mouse [1953] 087 - Downhearted Duckling [1953] 088 - Pet Peeve [1954] (widescreen) 089 - Touché, Pussy Cat! [1954] (widescreen) 090 - Southbound Duckling [1954] (widescreen) 091 - Pup on a Picnic [1953] (widescreen) 092 - Mouse for Sale [1953] 093 - Designs on Jerry [1953] 094 - Tom and Chérie [1955] (widescreen) 095 - Smarty Cat [1954] 096 - Pecos Pest [1953] 097 - That's My Mommy [1955] (widescreen) 098 - The Flying Scorceress [1955] (widescreen) 099 - The Egg and Jerry [1956] (widescreen) 100 - Busy Buddies [1956] (widescreen) 101 - Muscle Beach Tom [1956] (widescreen) 102 - Down Beat Bear [1956] (widescreen) 103 - Blue Cat Blues [1956] (widescreen) 104 - Barbecue Brawl [1956] (widescreen) 105 - Tops with Pops [1956] (widescreen) 106 - Timid Tabby [1956] (widescreen) 107 - Feedin' the Kiddie [1956] (widescreen) 108 - Mucho Mouse [1956] (widescreen) 109 - Tom's Photo Finish [1956] (widescreen) 110 - Happy Go Ducky [1956] (widescreen) 111 - Royal Cat Nap [1957] (widescreen) 112 - The Vanishing Duck [1957] (widescreen) 113 - Robin Hoodwinked [1957] (widescreen) 114 - Tot Watchers [1957] (widescreen) so, is this correct? or should others be included? |
I watched a DVD at Christmas, and I know for a fact that "O-W-T" was in it, because I was laughing at that joke.
I just love those old Mammy shorts. It's NOT racist -- it's an ethnic history of the time period (WWII +/- a couple decades), and it's largely lost at this point in time. I know of a few really old black ladies in the deep South, with that sort of accent, though far more educated. When that generation passes, T&J cartoons and other media will be our only connection to the southern "Negro" generation (the proper non-racist term for that period in our history). A few posts back, the "usa" version is clearly a film scan. The others come from video broadcast masters of some sort, possibly 16mm distributions (china version). |
LS - you may be correct about the USA screenshot - about it being from a film scan.
however, as you can see, it is cropped - at least on 3 sides: top - less of the frame on the wall left - less of jasper's left ear and sofa bottom - less of female moggie's paws ok, so the cropping is not a complete turn-off. but that and the not so clean image and the cuts/edits all add up to a poor result. shame really. |
I got the set more than 5 years ago but i was told by the trader i got it from that it was uncut and uncensored. This is the only tom and jerry set I have so there's nothing I can compare it with.
|
It's really not cropped as much as the 4:3 doesn't match. Remember these were mostly widescreen (or other native non-4:3 film sizes) back in the day. Technically, they're all cropped somehow. There's no way to avoid it, when filling the screen for TV/DVD releases.
The film can be cleaned with DaVinci Revival: http://www.blackmagic-design.com/pro...avincirevival/ To a lesser degree, VirtualDub or Avisynth filters. Is that USA clip interlaced? If not, then there are some median filter options. If interlaced, IVTC it first, before trying a median filter. |
tom and jerry 6 dvd hong kong notes:
Some episodes are cropped a little bit. You can tell because you cant see all the writing in the opening titles. The color on most of the early episodes are bright. Also, almost all the episodes blocked the mgm lion in the beginning and replaced it with their own screen. You can still hear the lion roaring, you just can't see him. Ok I looked at the episodes you said had cuts and compared them with the episodes on the hong kong set. Almost all the episodes are uncut and uncensored except for the following: "Puss N' Toots": It has the chinese segment but doesn't have the filing cabinet or mammy scene. Its funny because you can see half the scene in the menu but it is not in the episode. "Saturday Evening Puss": I have the episode with the white teenager and jerry's rant is muted "His Mouse Friday": All dialogue muted out. It does have the small cannibal Also "Part-Time Pal" aired in 1946 |
DJ17 - i'm not fighting with you - but everywhere i look on the internet states "part-time pal" aired in 1947.
why do you say it aired in 1946? |
LS - can't say whether the usa screengrab is interlaced or not. i took all this info from various sites so we could have it on CPS.
i believe it is from the USA Spotlight Collection. so you could check it out for yourself as you may have those discs? |
i believe all 13 Gene Deitch T&J cartoons are available in UK/Europe
115 Switchin' Kitten 116 Down and Outing 117 It's Greek to Me-ow 118 High Steaks 119 Mouse Into Space 120 Landing Stripling 121 Calypso Cat 122 Dicky Moe 123 The Tom and Jerry Cartoon Kit 124 Tall in the Trap 125 Sorry Safari 126 Buddies Thicker Than Water 127 Carmen Get It! amazon uk stocks it. not sure if it's available in USA. |
8 Attachment(s)
Here is some pictures menu of the 10 DVD Hong Kong set:
Attachment 1202 Attachment 1203 Attachment 1204 Attachment 1209 Attachment 1205 Attachment 1206 Attachment 1207 Attachment 1208 |
Quote:
|
hey MD - you can read mandarin? fantastic !
|
from what i've read on the internet (and who would trust that medium?!) if you get the T&J spotlight collection volume 2, then all the cartoons are uncut / uncensored.
however, you must make sure you get the re-issued discs as they messed up the initial release. and as good as that is, the downside is that the image quality is not as great as it can be. mainly due to the loss of the original film stock in a fire or something. so it looks like between the T&J spotlight releases and the HK set we can put together a full, uncut, uncensored, HB set. |
part time pal - if BCDB are to be believed, this aired on March 15, 1947.
yet i have seen this short cartoon given a 1946 air date in other sites ! so which is it? i tend to favour BCDB. what do you say? |
@Uncle Chuck
Indeed, too pricey for probably 99%+ of members. I just wanted to mention something like that exists. :) I'd opt for Virtualdub, Avisynth or even Avidemux over Handbrake. Handbrake is a "dummy friendly" all-in-one sort of program. It just does basics, nothing higher end, in terms of quality. I doubt it would help much for this sort of project. @manthing I'd have to see video clips -- original/unaltered -- to know if it's interlaced. |
3 Attachment(s)
I base the copyright date to be 1946 because of the roman numerals they have on the episode title. It's a little hard to read but it says MCMXLVI
It was also ordered differently in the Hong Kong set. The episode before it was 1946 and the episode after was 1946. Attachment 1211 Attachment 1212 I took a snapshot of that scene with Tom and the female cat so you can compare it with the rest of the sets. Its the last frame where you can still see the end of Jerry's tail on Tom's hand. Hong Kong 6 DVD Set Attachment 1213 I like the menus on the 10 dvd set. |
2 Attachment(s)
i am checking a few things out. listen to these 2 audio clips and let me know which one is the original one. thanks.
|
What episode is that from?
|
its from "dog trouble" - towards the end.
|
Just checked my episode, it's audio2. The second one sounds more southern than the first one. Her voice kind of reminds me of LaWanda Page.
|
right thanks. i'm double checking as i'm creating my own set and wanted to make sure i got the right stuff. cheers.
|
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:37 PM — vBulletin Copyright © Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd
|